The Great Pro10/World GT Debate!

[rcshadow]

Hey Blake;

   I used some of the WGT Spec Llilac Tires this season and part of last season. Front and back. I even used them at the Richmond race, I did have to change them for some green rears but that said, they seemed to work, I think they came in after a few rounds so truing may be a factor. I can bring some gently worn front and rears if you want to try the whole thing this sunday, weather permitting or course.  I am only planning on running nitro if the day turns out nice .....which it is supposed to RIGHT MOTHER NATURE....lmao...

[Tom]

Wow, lots of posts to wade through.

A couple points.

• A 1 cell setup will require twice the current for the same power as a 2 cell setup.  As it is, it's the motors that limit the power we can use in these cars.  So, the increased current demands to achieve similar power levels with half the voltage will be super hard on equipment.  I think this is a bad idea.  I like how lithium batteries can handle the abuse we put them through; I'd be afraid to see how a 1 cell setup would handle double the abuse (actually, more than double as the efficiency goes way down).
• As has been said above, the spread between the fastest cars and the slowest cars isn't due to the speed of the cars, but rather the skill of the drivers.  If we want less of a spread between 1st and last in every race, we need more racers (making more races), pure and simple.  We've got a similar spread in every class we run.

Personally, I love how Pro 10 is fast, and how fun the cars are to drive when they're set up properly and run on rails.  The chassis needs lots of power to handle properly; a slow car generates little downforce, so it doesn't handle well.

I don't see what the appeal is if the cars are made to run slower.

As far as cars spinning out is concerned, this isn't due to having too much power, rather it's all in the setup.  You'd be hard pressed to spin out Blake's yellow lightning bolt when it's competitive.  Given how simple these cars are, it's not too expensive to make chassis adjustments.

I don't like how we're an island when it comes to this class, and if we want to run it anywhere else, it's put on as a courtesy for us to run together.  I'd love to see us be able to meet up with other groups who run the same cars.

Having said that, the reality is we are on an island.  It seems that we've started to pique the interest of some other clubs, as can be seen by Ryan's attempt last weekend, and Franko's run in Central Saanich Daze.  Maybe the right thing to do is continue on as is, and have others join up with our formula.

What I don't want to see is changing the class so it looses its essence, and turns into something that's hard on equipment (1 cell), or doesn't handle (slower, or no GTP body).

[Blake]

I can bring some gently worn front and rears if you want to try the whole thing this sunday, weather permitting or course.

Thanks Glenn.  Yes, please bring these tires on Sunday.

Blake

[Blake]

A 1 cell setup will require twice the current for the same power as a 2 cell setup.  As it is, it's the motors that limit the power we can use in these cars.  So, the increased current demands to achieve similar power levels with half the voltage will be super hard on equipment.  I think this is a bad idea.  I like how lithium batteries can handle the abuse we put them through; I'd be afraid to see how a 1 cell setup would handle double the abuse (actually, more than double as the efficiency goes way down

Ok good to know; that might explain the situation Ross was quoting.

However, there are currently a field of 1s 10.5 WGT cars circling the high-bite carpet track in Vegas, and there was a field of 1s 13.5 WGT circling a large outdoor asphalt track in California (ROAR Nats) back in August.  So, 1s with 10.5 or 13.5 is definitely electronically possible, and in fact, is the typical setup in the North American real world.

[RC51]

... so here's a shift in Europe: The European Pan series for indoor is running 1/12 GTP and 1/10 WGT. WGT has two classes: 1s 10.5 and 2s 17.5. Check it out: http://www.epsraces.net/Rules.htm

P.

[roofrider]

I agree that there is no replacement for the skills of the driver, and one day I may be there. However until then I am not the only one that suffers due to the lack of numbers. You could ask why are the numbers down ? I cannot answer that alone, personally I am somewhat discouraged because of it and when I put my car on the shelf that's one less and then the next guy etc. etc. get the picture. I don't know what the solution is I just know what is right for me and to continue as I am (not enjoying pro 10) I should concentrate on the one class I enjoy. You all know that we are there because we enjoy it.
I guess I am up to $0.04 now.

[Arch]

  Some where along the line "playing with toy cars " turned into F1 racing.Not here to bitch just stateing my 2cents

[jarrodH]

arch, it asnt changed that much(as for cost)..,tires are goin to cost what tires cost, parts break when they break....and the only real difference in electronics is the cost of the esc.. a brushless motor is only like 20$ more than a high quallity brushed motor.. for the lipo batteries.. u have to buy batteries anyway one year or another.. and the cost a of a good 6cell nimh battery is the same, or darn close to a decent lipo, witch last longer..

makin a bigger deal than it really is..

anyways..


i like the way the pan cars look with the gtp bodies.. i like how they are faster and harder to drive. tho i dont race one, i have done laps with a few, and i liked it alot...was a blast

i think goin to a spec tire would help alot by itself..

[Arch]

I never mentioned cost at all.Its the difference in the amount of laps between 1st and 2nd ,2nd and 3rd,and so on.Geez lighten upJrod

[Shawn68z]

 Just a quick point about this class.  I like having so much power in the car that you actually have to learn how to drive it to keep it on the track.  If we could run 4.5 it would make me even happier, because all those fancy top dollar speedos dont make a difference when you cant hook the power up. 

 If you switch to WGT spec, its a matter of who has this weeks speedo and software just like in touring. 

So what it comes down to for myself is, keep it fast ( I personally like it right now),  or if the club does decide to WGT it, then go one step further and have the guys with the fancy speedos run the ROAR Spec firmware, that doesnt have the Boost, and turbo functions enabled.   Then you would have closer to a spec series that is slower, and doesnt force people to buy new speedos.

Cheers,
Shawn.

[DekelzMan]

I just came across a great thread on RC Tech that has been going on since World GT started:

http://www.rctech.net/forum/electric-road/280257-world-gt-body-debate-thread.html

It's actually about the World GT Spec bodies but the class itself is brought up numerous times. Answers a lot of our questions and brings up many more….Worth a read if you have a few hours, LOL, I'm about 9 pages in and it's already had replies from a few of the body manufacturers…

A few buckets more food for thought…..

[BCbud]

 However, at least we'll be running a standard ROAR class.  So, when I'm advertising Speed Weekend 2011, and people are asking about the pan car class, I don't have to reply with:  "Uh... yes, it's WGT... sort of.  Just double up on the battery, find a 10.5, we'll lend you a GTP body, and THEN you can race with us....".

Blake

Good day!

As I have been looking at the different cars for this class, some like BMI and Associated will only fit a 1 cell so they could not be fitted with a 2 cell and a 13.5 to race with us.

 

 If you switch to WGT spec, its a matter of who has this weeks speedo and software just like in touring. 

Cheers,
Shawn.

With more and more of the timing adjustable ESC's coming out with a no boost setting, we could concider running with no boost. That would make the cars more even and allow for less expensive, non boosted ESC's to be used and make it easyer for new drivers to enter the hobby.

My .02 worth for today, Neil.

[DekelzMan]

Hmmmm…I don't like the road this is going down suddenly….

I don't want to see WorldGT turning into the entry level class. I think slowing the cars down to make things a little more even makes sense but dumbing this down to 1 cell, 17.5 no boost will make this a yawn-fest. I'd make touring STOCK the no-boost class and make WorldGT the higher performance of the two....

[cyrrus]

Niel

the bmi can take both single cell and double cells packs.  and yes that is for both the reg bmi and the new copper head. 

Andrew

[BCbud]

Hmmmm…I don't like the road this is going down suddenly….

I don't want to see WorldGT turning into the entry level class. I think slowing the cars down to make things a little more even makes sense but dumbing this down to 1 cell, 17.5 no boost will make this a yawn-fest. I'd make touring STOCK the no-boost class and make WorldGT the higher performance of the two....

1 cell 10.5